Firesong and Sunspeaker Game Knights Deck Tech l The Command Zone #262 l Magic: the Gathering EDH



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Show Notes:

On this episode we’re breaking down JLK’s Firesong and Sunspeaker deck from the latest episode of Game Knights. Y’all tried to troll him by voting that he had to play Boros, but the deck turned out really awesome and powerful. Let’s find out what makes it tick!

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Josh’s Firesong and Sunspeaker Deck List:

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What we talked about on THE END STEP:

The OA (Netflix):

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greetings humans you have entered the commands your destination for all aspects of elder dragon Highlander enjoy your stay what's up everybody you're watching slash listening to the commands own podcast here in sunny Los Angeles we've never done that that way you're like a regular lesson california i'm your host jimmy wong how is it it's Josh leak why yeah well what great morning we got some traffic out there on the 5 right now and things are looking rough you've got some tunes for you will be singing we've got 32 minutes of non-stop music oh yeah it's right before your first commercial break booming music here at 98.2 cz FM the breaking news today Josh Leake why known for his appearances on game nights has broken Boros through audiences had no idea if it could be done turns out it can be done and Josh showed that in magnificent order I don't know about breaking but yes you all on the latest game nights we put out the call we let everybody vote on which color pair which guild each player would be playing and y'all tried and troll me and may have helped ya who wants to see Josh be quite late for us the crowd goes actually very high they were like I don't want that but yeah it went viral esque in a way and Josh had to play Boros on her last game that's episode I played rack DOS Rachel played or Java and Kenji played not sanic is it yeah so we're gonna be breaking down my fire song and son speaker deck from that episode a lot of people were surprised with how well it played I was a little surprised as well know I'd played it a few times so I knew the deck was strong yeah so a lot of people express interest in hearing us break it down so we're gonna do that before we get into it we do need to talk about our sponsors you know if you want to build a really cool Boros deck either this one or we just previewed a really sweet Boros legendary creature form or the smarter let's just deck tag that yeah I actually think that decks probably anything better than this day oh I think it's actually much better than this deck yes talk about that so you can go to card Kingdom home slash command zone right now and pick up Boros cards basically for either one of these decks or you can just pre-order your booster boxes your bundles all that type of stuff and you're gonna buy magic cards anyway you really are helping out this show game act all of our content when you use the affiliate link when you do buy the cards and while you're there ultra pro represent the Legion the Legion did approve that's the top comment on the last video yeah so the Legion approves and we're you have a way to do that with ultra pro project with their play mats deck boxes sleeves across every every way you want to you can find a way to themed your play mats to be whatever guild you want in this case we are talking about Boros that's a lot of Boros on the command zone this week yeah that is actually that and the final way to support all of our content is directly if you get a patreon.com slash command zone you know we have a really good community you can ya chat with jimmy and i daily where our on our discord server quite a bit these days and there's a lot of other people on there if your deck building brewing whatever there's a ton of experience eth players yeah way more than me to be honest they're giving out advice i'm all the time hearing about cards where i'm like i have never even heard of that card but it seems awesome yeah so our discord is available to patrons at a certain level if you go to patreon.com slash command zone and also we call out one lucky patron every single episode and this episode is dedicated to keith rupp keith you rock keep it up all right so let's go into fire song and son speaker the deck tech of course you guys said josh you're gonna play boris and i chose the one that did not have to do with attacking yeah this was the the by box preview program from oh right yeah fire saw and sent speakers for red in the white for a for six legendary creature Minotaur cleric 6cm see josh seem bad so far six meter Boros commander we all touted this is like this could be the card that saves Boros because it really was our only option yeah I think listen I think the deck is good we'll talk about it okay so if our song and Sun speaker says red instant and sorcery spells you control have life linked and whenever a white instant or sorcery spell causes you to gain life fire someone sent speaker deals three damage to target creature or player so your red spells gain your life and your white life game smells kind of deal damage right yeah it kind of like synergizes in that way they are a fire song in the Sun speaker fire son red white so you know what do you think dude do you think this is a powerful when you saw it no I really didn't because one that's a six EMC commander it's gonna take a lot of time for you to even get it out there and then after that you have to play very specific spells you normally wouldn't in commander it's very prone to removal in that way and you're also directly making everyone very upset at you while you do these things right also this doesn't address any of the issues we have with Boros right there's not really card advantage yep there's not really ramp in there it's not attacking either which we usually tout attacking as like a not the best strategy being aggro but at the same time if you're gonna take away the strengths of the color pair and be like that's not actually even good in this deck it seems like it would be bad but it turns out that it is it does encourage you to build a spells based deck mm-hm which i think is just a more powerful way to go than like aggro combat attacking yeah it gives you more flexibility and as well learn just having powerful spells you don't need to necessarily have your commander out to make a difference in a lot ways yeah a lot of spells in the deck are still going to be good without fire songs on speaker but we'll be way better if they are out yep so I I did this deck tech a little different than normal usually we do sort of different categories building up to like how do you win yeah but to me I started out with how does this deck win when I was building it one of probably two ish ways there's two very specific ways that I thought the deck would try and win and then of course within the deck there are enough synergies that you can sort of put together a couple of other ways but they're not as efficient so the the main way that I thought the deck would win is with an earthquake style effect so there are well I'll just read rolling earthquake but there are a couple cards that basically have this same time in the net rolling earthquake is red and xfer sorcery and it deals X damage to each player and each creature without horsemanship regular earthquake does this except for instead of horsemanship it's flying lying yeah and there's there's a couple other cards they're similar but it's really the damage to each player that's a good way to win because yes it's stealing damage to you but because your spell has lifelink thanks to fire someone Sun speaker that damage to yourself is evened out not even even out you gained some life well you gain life off the other players and even out with you so if you did this for let's say X equals 20 that would deal 20 20 20 20 20 to yourself but that would even out so you'd gain 60 life off that exchange yeah and deal 22 everybody which is a lot and so that was one of the ways that I envisioned the deck being able to sort of win or finish off the the stragglers near the end of the game it's like boom big explosion I gain life so it doesn't kill me you all die yeah and even if you don't kill them you maim them to the point where they are within you know getting shot down by something and you are now at 7080 life in which case the other most powerful card in this regard it would be either flux reservoir and we did see the Sunday nights yeah and this is actually very popular commander cards obviously black and white and love life game decks will use this suit great advantage in storm decks as well it's a 4-man artifact and says whenever you cast a spell you gain one life for each spell you cast this turn and then the important text the more important taxes pay fifty life the ether flux reservoir deals 50 damage to target creature or player this is almost never going towards a creature I'll say that much yeah and and you're not even too worried about that every time you cast a spell you gain life thing a lot of decks are they're gonna try and chain together five six spells to gain the life to use this you're like no I'm gaining a ton of life off of a single earthquake at some point in the game or something like that and then either force reservoir just gives me a way to use all that life and finish off like a person or two people maybe Death Star people as people talk about it if you ever get to over a hundred life and you have ether flux reservoir it's nearly impossible to lose the game yeah no one can do anything to you because you would just be able to point it directly at them and say a thread of activation they can't even go to remove the ether force reservoir most of the time because if they do in response you laser them and anything they've got on the stack goes way with them only like crows and grips and certain like split-second cards yeah and and maybe like disallows things that counter activated abilities can really get you out of that but it's very difficult there's not a lot of cards that will get them out of the situation once you have it on the table and a healthy a really healthy life total and then you're playing yourself at a pretty severe disadvantage if you have to disallow and get rid of this in the same turn lots here to consider so if earthquake is gonna be a really good way to win the game you know I was trying to build in a bunch of ways to make the earthquake as impactful as possible and get some in a way some card ish advantage yeah and so you know doubling or forking the spell I thought was a really good way so if you can cast earthquake 420 but then you can make a copy of it while it's on the stack all of a sudden you're just killing everybody and you're gaining enough life from the first one that even though the first one comes out and takes out fire so I can sense weaker you survive the second copy so there's a lot of fork type spells those are two of them yeah reverberate and reiterate they both have the same text that say copy target instant or sorcery spell you may choose new targets for the copy reiterate specifically has an extra buyback cost of three mana so you can pay an additional three and this goes back to your hand very good card then the music's deck specifically but in this case while copying someone losing 1520 life that that is almost always gonna be lethal yeah and we saw in game nights we didn't say this at the beginning if you haven't watched the new game nights yet it's a couple weeks old at this point hopefully you have we may be spoiling some things that we're talking about the deck that was played so not a bad idea to stop the video right now go watch it and come back if you don't want the the ending yet ruined so going back to reverberate and reiterates and fork type spells these aren't just good to use on your own cards they're also really good to use on your opponent's cards like again we saw in game nights people cast very powerful spells in EDH and to be able to be like I get that spell for two mana or three mana is really strong how does read counter throw something by copying it yeah or they go to counter you you can oftentimes copy their counter and point your copy at their counter and save your spell or if they go to remove something you can remove something as well I mean this is a way that red gets access to other parts of the color pie it's not necessarily clean because you have to wait for someone else to do it but also you're limited in options in general so I'll take what I can get when it comes to that yeah I think I think these are under played cards in general I'm to other cards that can kind of help you fork or copy your earthquakes and things like that our primal amulet which is a artifact that the important part is it flips over and becomes a land that can copy spells when you cast them and pyromancers goggles which is a five man artifact that taps for red but if you use that mana on an incident or sorcery spell that's read you copy the spell so again with rolling earthquake and those types of things just double it up double it up and you're good you're gonna need a lot of man to do it too and here are some classic card set again usually are like you know it's like oh I can use this once to do something but you kind of need that one time you use it to win the game it that's kind of that's the whole that you're put in with this deck is you're very all-in on the law of your plays we just very much my play style but not yours I don't think so you kind of need to make sure that when you do go off that turn you have the ability to hold up all the man you need to so a card like mana geyser 3 read read it's a sorcery you add red to your mana pool for each tapped land your opponent's control if you can cast this usually people won't counter this part of it they'll see what you're gonna do with the man and encounter that so you get all the mana and then you're holding up a reiterate or a reverberate you have a billion mana so you can buy it back as well and you can also use cards like trees in this ogre one of my favorite cards 3 in a red for a to 3 ogres shaman it's got dethroned but more importantly you can it's an activated ability to pay 3 life and at red to your mana pool so at an to speed you're already getting all that life right so now you convert your life into ether flux reservoir stuff or you can use it for something like fire summon Sun speaker by having all that life and then just spend it all get a bunch of mana just keep going off turning your life into man are very powerful in a deck that like has a lot of life game yeah yeah and I like mana geyser is a card that you don't often want to play until your opponents are tapped out anyway so often it's just like they don't even have the ability to count or something it's a lot of times it's just like I get 25 min in my mana pool like yeah that is very often if you're gonna do that you're gonna win the game in a deck like this yeah and have the Eternals another one that just does a favor of yours Jim yeah actually all three of these cards are played in my mana read the hub deck because I'm a big man a real phazon you have hands yeah exactly so that's a way to get enough mana to sort of get off a big fireball or caught that but a big earthquake or something like that there's also some cheeky stuff you can do there stuffy doll and brush reckoner in the deck which are creatures that when they take damage they'll deal damage to your opponents and so you combine those with some of the board wipes like the earthquakes but also there's blasphemous act there's chain reaction in the deck and these are cards that are going to deal damage to all creatures you'll gain a bunch of life because a fire song and Sun speaker and if you have stuffy doll or Boris reckoner out that damage will be converted into damage against your opponent that's a good way to sort of end the game fire song and Sun speaker gives these things lifelink think of how powerful that is if there are like seven creatures out right few blasphemous act with seven creatures out it deals 13 damage to all seven creatures yeah so you'd gain 91 life right there Wow and that's like two minutes two minutes yeah it kills fire song and Sun speaker but a lot of times now matt91 life play treasonous ogre use sixty of it to make you know twenty mana and go crazy yeah that's the kind of stuff this deck can do right and it does require a bit of setup because you are going all in a lot of these cases but you definitely you want to get there right you once you have the combo built up it can sometimes be really hard to interact with you because you can just reiterate reverberate and you can buy it back because now you have a treasonous ogre or you have just tons of mana to use and you can sort of lock down the game that way yep so one of the cards I added was that didn't have in the original list on game X was hour of devastation but I realized his hour of devastation is three red red for a sorcery that deals five damage to all creatures and Planeswalkers five damage is the perfect number because fire song and Sun speaker has six toughness or six I don't know why I didn't have that in the list originally so if you only looked at the game Knights list you should look at it again I've made a few upgrades and that's one of them well in that game there were not too many creatures on the battlefield so yeah that's been too effective but yeah it's a great addition I think actually one thing I should know is I would have killed that stupid angel though yeah one thing about that game that's episode that one thing about who realizes how low the creature count wasn't told ya so actually a deck like yours a lot of times was at a bit of a distinct disadvantage because your cards like earthquake weren't also board wipes and blasphemous act wasn't easy card to cast I mean if you're facing a token deck and you have an earthquake in your hand hole even just doing it for three can sometimes gain you like an insane amount of life because if they have 30 creatures that can be like 90 I've I've been at like you know in the hundreds of life totals in this deck you know I think that actually answers the question about how Boros can get card draw just live long enough to get more turns like I have so much life but I'm gonna live long enough to draw more cards I mean it just give you a bit of a lease on life to be like at least I can continue the top deck for a little bit so it's not card draw it's just you know more being alive for a little bit longer and I think that kind of goes into the next section which is the rest of the deck honestly once you get past like the game main game plan which we just laid out is kind of like ramp card draw removal spell and board wipes and it's kind of just the plan is like don't let anybody go too nuts mm-hmm until I can assemble the situation I want which is I mana geyser into an earthquake or I reiterate an earthquake or I ether voice reservoir after I've blasphemous acted and gotten a million life right and that's kind of the the game plan and so having a lot of life plays into a control strategy because like you said time is important because you just want enough time to get the pieces together and you sure as heck aren't drawing that many cards and laurels either yeah yeah so there's us to your command cleansing meditation I think is a card we haven't talked about maybe enough on this show great card yeah it's a carbon threshold that says destroy all enchantments but if you have threshold which is if seven or more cards are in your graveyard you straight all enchantments and then you return to play all of the cards in your graveyard destroyed this way so basically everyone else is in champions but not yours and the deck doesn't have a ton of enchantments so even if you just need to fire that off a lot of times you're gonna be fine well red is not great dealing with that right right and why it is sort of where they have to go for that so that's why I stair command is just again one of the best board wipes in the game bar none there are some efficient removal spells lightening helix is a really good one it's a red and a white for an instant it deals three damage to a target creature or player and you gain three life but but it really deals six and you gain six because lightning helix deals three has life link so you gain those three then you gain three life and fire songs done speaker says if a white instant or sorcery would gain you life you deal three damage to something so then it deals three more so yeah to man at deal six Game six super efficient and just in the deck I didn't actually put like lightning bolt in here I still didn't think it was quite efficient enough no I think you I think a lightning helix is the right call if it's both colors and effects both says a fire song and Sun speaker and lightning helix sure someone like Ben Bateman might play it in their commander decks they love playing well you will probably get me with it yeah 100% but you do have the additional value I don't think just gaining life off a lightning bolt is enough right right you don't get the extra damage again like the lightning yeah exactly and then here's a card we just keep talking about more and more electro dominance card King accomplished commands oh and pick up a copy X red red instant it deals X damage to any target and you can cast a card with CMC cost X or less from your hand without paying its mana cost it's great where they give cards flash at instant speed because this is an instant this can just get people as well there's tons of different options and times when you'll cast this maybe you put out a blocker or you'll cast this and then you'll be able to throw the Sun for end of turn before some you don't really deal with it there's a lot of things like just a good way to sneak the ether flux into play at the end of turn so that you're not ready for it right and then the next sort of thing to talk about with the deck is the literally no yeah what Jimmy correctly identifies during that game nights episode as the best card in the deck by a long shot and I think most Boros decks if they have this card in it it will be the best card in the deck its son forger which you if you watch the episode you see like I get to the point where that's my entire game plan is that well you look at your hand you have two cards most of the game and I'm like son forger equipping and unequipping is my ability in my only ability to stay in the game and it's actually decent I was in the game yeah just with that game plan so let me read son forger it's three mana for stone for a artifact equipment equipped creature gets plus four plus out doesn't generally matter but it can because you make an eight six fire song inside speaker that's hitting people it's not like that doesn't matter at all but the big text is oh sorry it equips for three mana but the big text is you pay a red and a white and you unattached Sun forager and then you search your library for a red or white instant card with converted mana cost 4 or less and you cast that card without paying its mana cost so basically a 5 mana tutor 3 to equip red in the white on top of that find any red or white instant sorcery card not source we're just an instant yeah yeah with CMC 4 or less I think actually the four or less than was pretty important to you can get some bigger stuff with it yeah if you do for CMC you really only overpaid by one and you its card draw because it was in your library and now you're playing the card and if it's election card draw it's tutor tutoring yeah yeah because you're getting specific cards and specific answers and so most decks that have some forger will have a son forger package and there's sort of two ways that son forward son forger package can be can be meant the first is a couple of different ways to find the son forger so enlightened tutor steel shapers gift I talk a lot about steel shapers gift as a card I'll put in even though I only have like a skull clamp and a sort of feast and famine in the deck because there's no clamp is so good that like I just want another copy of it yes son for drip plays that role in this deck so steel shapers gift also there's a sort of fire necks that I recently put in there as additional card draw and yeah yeah that's good normally I would put feast and famine right right a feast and famine or that may be the life gain one yeah but in this deck I actually put fire and ice because of the card drawn on the sword and I wanted it but son fortunes the card you go get first it's just that you draw steel shapers gift when you already have son forger you can still use it for the other equipment mm-hmm so back to son forger package that also means the cards in the deck that are there because you know you could go get them with son forger and this is a really toolbox II thing and that's why when it's out it's so powerful because anything that happens at least the first couple of times until you start running out of gas for the son forger you have a way to deal with it it's funny red white has a few outside the color by things that like really give you a lot of play yeah and it the downsides right you can only equip it once it's on someone else's turn so you have to wait for it to come back but at the same time we talk about this Boris you are so limited in your options that that this even though it's it's good it's very powerful and I think this in any other color combination would be absurd right in Boros it just happens to be the best card because nothing else comes close to doing this even though it does have its limitations that just gives you another idea of like Josh didn't break Boros alright he made a great show of it but I think we only reference it once but you really had I just had no cards in your hand yeah higher game yeah so some of the cards in the Sun forager package that you can go get we saw player units lapse of certainty is a white counterspell we recently had a big discussion on the discord about whether it's a real counterspell I think people it's a tempo spell I really do think it's a real counterspell I think people overestimate the downside of well let's go and read the card chewing a white for an instant counter target spell it's a white card if that spell is countered this way put it on top of its owner's library instead of into that players graveyard so it does time walk them a little bit to because they have to redraw the spell and they're not gonna draw a new card the next turn yeah I think people think like oh a lot of people said well it really only delays them or whatever and and technically it reads that way but I've never played laughs of certainty where I thought it mattered that it went on top of their library I was never like oh man I just draw it next turn and what am I gonna do most of the time you're protecting something important that's gonna happen next turn or you're stopping somebody from winning right then and a lot of times it's like I stopped you from winning now everybody knows you're about to win and now we can concentrate on you and your window is gone yeah yeah yeah yeah and that happens I think a lot in commander which is like in 1v1 you only have yourself to rely on so delaying somebody is not that great because like well what are you gonna do when they now draw it and play it but in in a multiplayer game I have two other people what I'm gonna do is I have is basically what I've done which is I warn Jimmy and Mel that Craig is about to do this thing and they can now help me yeah yeah or and you know in the case of our game nights it was a little different where you did this to protect your own stuff yep I thought was a by far the most bizarre sequence of plays maybe ever the counterspell war between Boros and or java it happens it's on game nights – fairies protection a card we talk about all the time which can protect you from basically anything there's also two cards I think that are really good in the deck and unfortunately specifically what Rachel did at the end of game nights didn't allow these to come into play but there's comeuppance and deflecting palm I'll read deflecting palm it's red and a white for an instant the next time a source of your choice would deal damage to you this turn prevent that damage if damage is prevented this way deflecting palm deals that much damage to that sources controller so what can happen here is that they attack you with like a big creature you deflecting palm it and they take the damage they were gonna take from the big creature or like let's say they fireball you or some big source of damage I've won games with this playing this you can definitely steal a lot of games with this kind of card not to mention it triggers both sides of fire sauna and Sun speaker as well the problem with why I couldn't use that at the end of the game on game nights is because damage is not the same as loss of life and both exsanguinate and debt to the deathless our loss of life and not damage each player issue a lose his ex life it's not damaged there are a lot of comments about that but yeah just to read the card and you'll see again red and white if it was loss of life I think that's actually outside the color pies so you wanted it to deal specifically with damage being dealt to you by a source combat a spell whatever it is those cards steal games so there are times when Sun forgery is equipped and it wins you the game because you're like oh the Flexi pom you're dead now instead of me makes it really hard to play against this kind of deck – cuz it might be like well we just need to get him down to a certain life – although we have to all you swing at him and at a certain point someone's gonna get got ya by card like that also son forger can get reiterate can get reverberate can copy so it's it's like they go to cast some crazy and sort of sorcery that isn't even pointed at you and you're like oh time stretch I'll take two extra turns – yeah that kind of yeah yeah yeah yeah I mean yeah well they'll get their two extra turns first read with their crappy copies of the other versions of cards okay so before we go here because that's basically the deck it's not super complicated you know like I said trying to build up to a big earthquake rolling earthquake ether flux reservoir take advantage of something like that maybe some get a little crazy with the stuffy doll a Boros reckoner mhm and you know a blasphemous act and that kind of stuff that can't happen other fun combos many times how much does mean combo with three or more cards ago cool it magic dream time Christmas land that's not your main plan you may have to resort to it if you get lucky later but but most of the time you're just trying to control this out there remove key things and put together a really big earthquake or something like that but I did want to talk about two cards specifically that are sort of new ish and I think are for me at least becoming staples ish in these colors one for sure and one ish so the one that sort of I want to talk about first is stolen strategy and it's for in a red for an enchantment and it says the beginning of your upkeep exile the top card of each opponent's library until end of turn you may cast non-land cards from among those exile cards and you may spend mana as though or mana of any color to cast those spells so you kind of Attali other people's decks I mean you have to pay the mana to cast the cards say isn't require you to tap an attack that's right and you know you can spend man as those man of any colors you can't play LANs this way it doesn't say play the card you have just you have to cast it however in some ways it kind of draws you I was gonna say three cards a turn it draws you like one and I wanted to have 1.7 yeah cards turn around close to two cards of turn pretty good and the thing that I found with this card is very often you're taking things from the deck that your deck can't have so card draw you're like if you find a ristic study on this or if you find a slam dunk that card yeah rampant growths and stuff like that that your color can't do and that's the kind of stuff you can find from other people's decks I've really been very happy with still in strategy and decks that have red but not blue and not black I'm very likely to run this card maybe even some decks that have those two colors because it is fun yeah it's fun it adds a element of chaos which I always love and again like sometimes your opponent's just have extremely powerful cards I mean getting Isis that was pretty good yeah if you're playing against people that are good which you generally probably are then they're gonna have good cards in their deck and even I mean even if the deck just has some crazy jank stuff in it there's always the corner case scenarios and this happens to getting three players three different decks three all different colors around you you're gonna find something that's gonna make an impact on the game I played this unlimited in two of the giant and it's very good oh yeah it's absurd this is from cano start battle bar malabon yeah yeah so I would encourage people to go out there and pick up some copies of stolen tragedy I think it's a really good card alright I talked about the second compassed card in the deck this card we called it when the set came out Ravnica allegiance and I've seen it in play many times now and it is one of the best white cards period in the format period it's not path to exile nope although that's where that's the posture not in Lane tier it's not to various protection very protections but it's on that list it's smothering Taif alright that's the end the show everybody three and away for an enchantment whenever an opponent draws a card that player may play two if the player doesn't you create a colorless treasure artifact token with tap sacrifices our effect add one mana of any color womp – is really hard to pay – is really hard to pay and you saw it in the episode we paid for maybe three I think twice with you both times you know it was me of course it was me both times who else would it be I'm not trying to extinguish all my mana this card is insane every time it hits the table it's just like oh and it creates so much advantage for another do-nothing card either write it add their taxes your opponent's man Azores or it's by the time it gets back to you is going to give you a lot more mana a lot of times you can count on getting the treasures to the point where you can say I'm gonna play it I know I'm gonna get two treasures and then I'm gonna be used those two treasures before it even gets back to me so it actually didn't do nothing right it allowed me to cast like another spell yeah oh my gosh this is so good in our feather oh yeah oh yeah so good oh my gosh ain't no drawing card okay we were having a discussion on our discord the other day I'm curious for you to weigh in okay if if gun to your head you could only help oh yeah I saw this you could only have one of the following cards in your in your deck which would you have two fairies protection smothering ties those are your choices you can't have both you can only have one what do you put in smothering tithe I think so – yeah it's a very protective – one time use it exiled itself when I guess your gravy you never get to get it back some other time in general the way the way to win magic games is by playing cards and using mana and smothering time that's gonna get you more consistently I think if you put it on like a win percentage thing like times that you win because smothering Todd was able to ramp you out open you up to more spells get you it like when the mother actually just does one thing it just protects you I mean it's very good in it can win you games right right to various protection I mean listen I think it's fairly close but it's very obvious winter fairies protection wins you that game right because you're like something's about to happen I defers protection I live through it I kill you or I cast Armageddon and with that on this back I tear it whatever don't do that so your friends by the way um but smothering tithe is way more subtle because it wins you the game wait turns earlier than you actually win right like you win on turn 11 but smothering tithe actually won you the game on turn six seven and eight by giving you nine extra mana over those terms yeah and that man that will help you contribute to all the other parts of your decks are important it may help you get that card dress bailout it may help you to and play another card that turn it just gives you more options you just had enough extra mana to remove that key threat and do something yeah also I think what was underestimate about this car the most is how many extra cards people draw in commander yeah that's a good point it happens all the time it's weed we tell it all the time card draw is a very important part especially when you play a card like Wheel of Fortune alongside it oh yeah that's a whole nother thing lucky by the way that's definitely one of the one-two punches that the SEC needs to do to really set itself ahead imagine if you didn't draw anything off that that seven cards didn't have your ether flux reservoir I'm usually just not drawn the wheel – yeah I think I still great in that game but I'm just not rocketed into the lead yeah I think what people don't realize is you know it's like yeah Boros did a great job in these cards you need if you want to play Boris that's a way to do it but you drew it probably what at that point they gave me probably drawn 17 or 18 cards you got three of the cards that you definitely needed and it's not unlikely but it's it's on the unlikely or side I think yeah but going back to smothering time here I think that like consecrated sphinx ristic study people are drawing cards in commander they are not like going through their turns yeah and just like drawing my one for turn that's just not what decks do people are playing you know phyrexian arenas and they're playing all kinds of stuff the drawing card so smothering tide does not just give you three treasures every turn I bet you it a ver ajiz closer to five over the course of a game if you get it no one pays for it yeah yeah when they're not because if you're drawing two cards you have to take your entire turn to pay for that they're just not paying for it yeah I mean don't I mean honestly when I was playing that game I was just crossing my fingers and going I really hope Josh doesn't draw another creature because all he's doing is drawing one card at turn but he's making a million mana so you're just afraid of what that person can do with that mana smothering type is very good you have to pair it up with some sort of card draw in some way it's just like any other ramp spell right yeah you can run into the problem if I have tons of mana but nothing to do with it mhm but I just think that card is really really good so I wanted to talk about a little bit right here's some cards that I was considering for the deck and for a couple reasons didn't put in I just wanted to talk about so I think pyroblast or bread elemental blasts are both really good includes these r1 red mandatory blue permit yeah or counter a blue spell these are really good cards I think most red decks that don't have blue want to run these you run into a lot of blue and Commander the reason I didn't is because we knew the meta for that game everyone did everyone built around the fact that we're playing and you know these are the guilts we knew what guilds everybody else was gonna be and since only one deck was gonna have blue it didn't seem worth it to put that in now we didn't know the specific cards and everybody's decked but you knew like blue deck so you may have put in a blue elemental blast if you knew that Kenz you know he's playing blue so if you think cyclonic rift is really gonna blow you out that hard right yeah you might that would be the corner case I think but I think in your average Boros deck put it in there because most games there's gonna be a couple of decks with blue in them and if there's two decks at the table with blue gnam and often you're against three let's be honest then that's one mana any of their spells like it it becomes a really good card I mean not to mention though you do have reiterate and reverberate in this deck so people have some protection against it but yeah I think if you're met that tends to run more heavily towards blue it's always nice to have two options you know it's like I have a raid array and an elemental blast someone plays a blue spell you're gonna want to counter with this specific card they can do it because you don't want to save your reverberate for something more important later on dictate of the twin gods is three red red for an enchantment flash and it basically doubles damage mhm and I think that's a card that I would think about adding because it's another way to sort of quote-unquote fork your earthquake yeah flashing on the end set before you turn now casts the earthquake now my twenty damage does forty kills everybody in the other just being mildly annoying friends of Wrath I think I think other one more wheels more ways to just draw cards really we I really only had the one but I think reforged the soul is probably and I would think about I don't like the ones that count the number of cards in your hand and shuffle and draw that many because you don't get card advantage off that yeah you're actually losing the card and then you count the cards in your hand and if you don't have a lot card to begin with like Josh didn't have for the entirety of the game then it's hard to refill your hand in that way yeah people don't maybe understand why Wheel of Fortune is so good and an expensive card and was you know it was restricted back in the day it's because it draws you seven no matter what so if you can play all your cards go down to one or two cards cast it it just do you five yeah yeah so it's very very good yeah so and then I put not mana tithe this is a very popular comment in our last game nights at all if Josh if only you had mana tithe to stop Rachel from doing all that stuff so mana tide is one white mana for a force spike in white it says you know counter target spell unless the opponent pays one more mana here's the thing and a lot of people are like if you had it you could eat some forward for it encountered the debt to the deathless here's why I don't like mana tithe in general is because one mana so often your opponent will just have that on accident to pay for the spell it's not all the time that they just tap out for an X spell also if they know you have it they're never going to not play around it yeah it's easy to play around but also they just play around it on accident so I don't like a counter spell that's just not reliable yeah it's not I'd much rather have lapse of certainty I know what it's gonna do every time it's gonna stop it right now mm-hmm sure yeah that goes to the top of their library but at least mana ty there's just a chi Picard that you have in your hand you're like I really would like to counter that but they just have the mana yeah I really and that's the worst like mana drain or something's like I really just hope they just like you'd rather have like a syncopate or something in your hand where you can at least make sure that the kid that what you're gonna do is counter their their spell yeah so mana tithe yes I know a lot of you thought I should have that I do not actually believe it's a very good card in most of the time yes will you get people out of nowhere sometimes sure yes but I think that's more than balanced out in fact over balance out by the times when you just it's just dead in your hand yeah and there's plenty of other cards again that do a similar thing to a counter spell that you can use if you need to do it their way or you know you just have other options to be more flexible than manna tie this yeah so the last note here is Boros problems and listen the deck is quite good it's high variance though I played it a number of times both before and after game nights and it can definitely win games but it can definitely have those games where it just doesn't put the pieces together Ariel on fun games by the way and a lot of games I just find myself at a point where I don't have a lot of cards in my hand I don't feel like I have very many options it's not this situation I'm used to being in so I'm very cognizant when it's happening to me that's like uh I just feel like I have three cards and I just have no way to refill my hand and so I really can only do one thing or two things like I just don't I don't have choices way to feel about cards like howling mine yeah I have a howling mine in the deck there you go so just because listen if you're in blue and you got ristic study out giving you one more card turn it's not as big a deal as me getting one more card yeah so I feel like it's not that much more down so this deck is definitely dependent on the fact that you got to draw the right stuff at the right time but also have a way to yeah cuz I again like we saw what what happened if Josh had just drawn a little bit differently he may be Amy it was only because of some forgery you were able to always have a relevant answer and smothering time his mother combined like gave me the manager to recast the commander over never because thinking you know I'm smothering died in that game I'm just totally out of it cuz yeah I can't even recast the commander it was costing 12 man by the end yeah exactly so again the deck is very good there definitely been points where I'm at 287 life or whatever like that's it is it is cool and life linker can take you to that total yeah download life linker on the App Store's if you guys want the life linker app that we use when we are playing the game alright the listener to the listeners do you have a favorite Boros deck yeah it's probably this one do you think the color pair red white is as weak as we say or are you one of those people that disagrees and think that thinks that it's just fine we do have hear from people that say I don't think Bros needs any help at all I think it's totally fine which seems nuts to me but maybe when that loves red I can disagree with you confidently there maybe with feather and a few more like that will eventually get there but the problem or smothering time yeah and I think the way they're doing it doesn't really break it's like one creature that you need to base everything around some at least it's legendary at least it's legendary yeah I think we knew need more cards on the level of smothering time maybe a couple more like that that card is so good it single-handedly makes white you know a few percentage points better than it was like yeah that's crazy for one card to do that yeah but it's still not enough to sort of push the color pair into the realm of the other color pairs yeah okay well since we've talked up some forager smothering tithes stolen strategy fires arm so then speaker feather you can probably pre-order right now war the spark if you want any of that stuff go to card Kingdom comm slash command zone when you use that affiliate link you really are supporting all of our shows all of our content game nights everything else you're getting the cards you want and you're just getting all that stuff thrown in as gravy we really appreciate it yeah fire something says figured it was a bye box promo so if you buy a box of water the spark you're gonna get the tessarin that's a perma one oh yeah that card actually looks really a static ability of unity pretty nuts also while you're over at card Kingdom or at your local game store ultraPro sponsors this show you can find some ultra pro product like again Josh was really able to rep Boros with these sweet Boros sleeves algebra always has product that's relevant to the set that's coming out and they always do stuff that's me throwing back to old sets as well we've seen them print awesome play mats for all the GPS so supporting ultra Pro also supports this show yeah we really appreciate that okay now it's time for the instep where we talk about something outside the world of magic Josh is turning his entire body to me right now I have something oh you do yeah that was the Jimmy time to Phil no actually I actually it's my turn because you've saved me over the last couple of times okay all right I'm down it's a show on Netflix it's called the Oh a have you seen it no okay so I think I got suggested because we like stranger things a lot okay and it's kind of this weird supernatural thriller thing it's hard to explain it's a mystery type show I put it in the category of stranger things are like lost those things where you're like learning about characters but there's something weird in the past and you're putting pieces together try to figure out what are you going on there's some shows yeah there's some supernatural stuff although unlike the JJ Abrams show I don't want to throw but we can all toss some shady JJ he knows unlike some of those shows Damon Lindelof your questions yes they have a it's clear that they have a an answer to the some other course okay great it's not like they're like just throwing our questions that they're like we don't know we have no idea well a lot of the times is like the thrill of the question is better than the answer itself it's like no no no not one of the answers yeah I want to know that you have the answer so I can trust you and so the Oh a on Netflix is a pretty cool show we've been enjoying me and my girlfriend so how many episodes so there's two seasons and I'm not sure how many episodes per season were in like first season like Episode seven so what's it about okay so break down okay it starts and there's this girl and she jumps off a bridge in New York she survives her parents come to the hospital and she doesn't recognize them because she was blind but now she can see whoa so she's never actually seen your parents yeah she's never actually seen her parents but then when she puts her hand on their face she recognizes them and stuff but then we start finding out you know she's been missing for a few years at that point whoa whoa okay do other people start unlocking things yeah yeah and she does too so it's working like that I like that a lot yeah something else that you out there might like is our sister podcast might you will love the masters of modern Alex Kessler who was just on the show last week and Ben Bateman they talked about the modern format and all things competitive magic you know war the spark modern horizons there's a whole bunch of crazy stuff coming into modern right now it's gonna there's the mythic championship in London which is also modern they're trying up at London Mulligan modern is going through a lot of changes right now and if you want to keep on top of everything that's happening alex has been there gonna get you a speed faster than anybody so you can find them on twitter at the mmm cast right next to us at collective got company or if you type masters of modern into your search bar search bar on Lauren tube or search bar on YouTube that is where you're gonna find them because we're doing video content now to the editors for this show our probably combination of Ashlyn Rose rose oh that's good like those like us and Josh Murphy yeah Ashlyn says the angelic quality to it although she's more of a causal like kind of person yeah well actually I don't think they're cognizant really what they're doing but they perhaps these other people did see them as angels and of course special thanks to Geoffrey Palmer for doing the living card animations that you see behind us on set as well as the intros and outros of the show we are in the steam vents today oh yeah sorry we're talking about Boros but we have it is it we just didn't have it Boris back now this is just our real true calling red and blue actually kind of lines up really well there's the blue sides over there yeah perfect perfection all totally planned planned always alright everybody thanks for watching and we'll see you next time peace thank you for your attention for further enquiries send an email to command cast at rocketjump calm or ask us on twitter at jf long end at Josh Lacroix see you later alligator greetings [Laughter]